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Rantings of a Sandmonkey

Be forewarned: The writer of this blog is an extremely cynical, snarky, pro-US, secular, libertarian, disgruntled sandmonkey. If this is your cup of tea, please enjoy your stay here. If not, please sod off

Monday, December 12, 2005

Australian angry crowd singles out and attacks middle easterners

Greeeeeeeeeaaaaaaaaaaattttttttt! ANGRY crowds have singled out and bashed people of Middle Eastern appearance at Sydney's Cronulla beach as racial tension erupted into violence. And an ambulance called to the scene to treat five people injured in today's violence has been attacked by a mob who shattered its windows. Meanwhile, police have been pelted with beer bottles, and their patrol cars stomped on, as the outnumbered officers struggled [...] "What has been occurring on some fronts is that people of Middle Eastern backgrounds that have been seen in the Cronulla area – a swarm of the crowd has approached these people with vile abuse, in the most un-Australian way," Mr Goodwin said. "We have a number of reports of persons that have been assaulted." He said the bulk of the crowd had behaved but pockets of violence had broken out. "... we have sections of the crowd that have swollen towards young Arabic males and females, who have been using this beach." Three people have been arrested so far, with more arrests expected. Earlier today, police rushed to Cronulla train station where a mob ran there from the foreshore after receiving a text message saying a group of Lebanese people were trying to leave. Mr Goodwin said the text message was wrong, but sparked a scuffle at the station between the crowd and police. [...] It was not clear if any of the arrests related to earlier witness reports of at least three men being pursued and attacked as they tried to get away from angry members of the crowd chasing them on foot. At least two of the men took refuge at Northies Pub, where police gathered to protect them. Roads were closed down as the violence flared today, with mounted police trying to maintain control lines as a police chopper hovered over the beach. [...] One of the messages had urged "Aussies" to take revenge against "Lebs and wogs". Another urged locals to rally at a point on the beach today to take retaliation against "middle eastern" gangs. As the 5,000-strong crowd moved along the beach and foreshore area today, one man on the back of a ute began to shout "No more Lebs" – a chant picked up by the group around him. Others in the crowd, carrying Australian flags and dressed in Australian shirts, yelled "Aussie, Aussie, Aussie ... Oi, Oi, Oi". I guess that rules out any plans I had to immigrate to Ozzie, huh? Maybe I should just avoid the beaches! Hmm......... Update: Tim Blair has a round-up that shows the roots of this attack. Apparently there is enough blame to go around on both sides as shown by this timeline: * Last weekend some people, probably Lebanese Muslims, bashed a bunch of lifeguards at Cronulla Beach, including knocking one unconscious. They also harassed girls and women on the beach. * Residents, pissed off by the violence, got angry at the lack of police attendance and presence. * The anger morphed into a rage that the beach was being “invaded” by people from the western suburbs (i.e., a euphemism for Lebanese Muslims). * Some people started texting to incite others to “defend the beach” from thugs. * Today they did that by forming a violent, rowdy, mob. Fantastic. So some lebanese gang members started it, and 5000 australians responded by attacking anyone who even looks like they are middle-easterners. Idiots all around. Here is some more history on this "conflict" here. It's complicated. There's a long history of harassment by Lebanese Muslim street gangs at Cronulla. The weekend's events follow the attack last weekend by such a gang against two volunteer lifesavers (lifeguards). However, the actual rioters seem to have been attacking anyone of middle-eastern appearance, without regard to their particular religion. And there have been reports of white supremacist/neo-Nazi involvement, although that's via the MSM, so usual grain of salt applies. The destructive rampage in Maroubra where around 100 cars were vandalized was apparently the same street gangs who provoked the whole mess in the first place. So, for some of the participants, it was a race riot. Some of them were just drunken yobs looking for a fight. Some of them just came along to "take back the beach" and got caught up in the chaos. But it was specifically Lebanese Muslim gangs involved. There are a lot of Lebanese Christians in Sydney, but they don't seem to have the same tendency to form gangs and harass people. There is a joke that the Boondocks cartoon once made: It said that after 9/11, while Black people became the third most hated minority group in America amongst white people, Black people remained the most hated group amongst Black people. While I am not excusing the racist neo-nazi fuckheads who attacked those innocent beach-goers, I know what Aaron Mcgruder meant by making that joke! Update: Oh, Joy. The violence is spreading.

24 Comments:

At 12/12/2005 06:04:00 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Reminds me of the riots against Christians in Alex.

It is because of posts like these that people see you as self hating btw.

Karim

 
At 12/12/2005 06:31:00 AM, Blogger The Sandmonkey said...

Hmmm....

They are not wrong. I hate stupid arabs who do stupid shit like that, the same way I expect any self-respecting white person to hate stupid neo-nazi white supremacist idiots. I am guessing people who fail to make this kind of distinction would also fall in the stupid category, and therefore should be expected to be hated by me as well. So, them hating me for it, is all good by me. :)

I love smart arabs though, and since I view myself as one, and I know I love me, than I guess I am not much of a self-hater now am I? :P

 
At 12/12/2005 06:32:00 AM, Blogger The Sandmonkey said...

PS: I do acknowledge en ana mostafezz though. Is that what you meant?

 
At 12/12/2005 06:48:00 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Personally SM, I think self-criticism shows high self-esteem on your part. I mean that.

As for the riots...I think the fact that there was so many people involved is a bad omen. Get the police over there.

SM, you should come to the states.

 
At 12/12/2005 08:16:00 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

www.smh.com.au/articles/2005/12/11/1134235944844.html

This article has the best background to what has built up to this.

 
At 12/12/2005 09:32:00 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

No, not mustafezz, that doesn’t matter. The fact that it’s a given that you’ll take the position against people of our background almost indiscriminately is what alludes to self hatred.

As I mentioned this incident is closely correlated to the Church incident in Alex. In the way the minority may have provoked the majority but received a disproportionate response that included violence and hence made the Christians the clear victims and the Muslim rioters the clear aggressor. At least in my eyes. In my opinion in these circumstances, it is the switch from “we have a problem here” to violence that determines who is wrong.

We at that point felt compelled to help right the wrong and we did the Church vigil. Your presence and support was admirable. But now compare your stance and your posts on the subject to how you dealt with, granted an imperfect but none the less viable, opposite circumstance and you’ll understand what I mean.


Karim Elsahy

 
At 12/12/2005 10:17:00 AM, Blogger EgyPeter said...

SM and Karim -

First of all SM, YOU are awesome (and btw hillarious) you speak the truth, regardless of whether you are speaking the truth for or against Muslims or Christians...truth is truth no matter how you spin it! Self-depracating humor is the funniest of all types of humor!

Karim - Is it IMPOSSIBLE for a Muslim to criticize another Muslim?? This may be the biggest problem in the Arab region. And to compare the Alexandria assault of a peaceful church to what is going on in Austrailia is ABSOLUTELY RIDICULOUS!! St. Gerorge's Church in Alexandria was under siege by angry Muslim mobs (waving Korans and chanting death to the infidels) because of what the damn Muslim Brotherhood conspired against the Christians prior to the Alexandrian districts elections. They were the ones responsible for distributing that play (which took place ONCE over TWO years ago)to crazy fanatics intent of hurting anyone or anything non-Muslim. The Christians in Egypt did nothing to instigate the response of the fanatics that are running around Egypt. There were no Christian gangs running around Alexandria assaulting people on beaches like the case in Australia that sparked the riots...SO to compare the two is just simply way off base!

And SM...if you ever come to the states you have a roommate in Chicago!!! If you can handle 10 feet of snow you are more than welcome at my house :)

 
At 12/12/2005 01:17:00 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Peter I do not think it wrong for a Muslim to criticize another Muslim and it probably is one of our biggest problems. I agree with you and in the post you responded to I called “the Muslim rioters the clear aggressor”. Self criticism, in my view is essential. One look at my blog would tell you that. And no it is not a bad correlation. True the crisis in Australia was sparked by Lebanese thugs but the victims were indiscriminately every Middle Eastern looking person around. Do you think I would have wasted my time if they had gone and kicked those two Lebanese kids’ asses? They didn’t.

Greeeeeeeeeaaaaaaaaaaattttttttt!

ANGRY crowds have singled out and bashed people of Middle Eastern appearance at Sydney's Cronulla beach as racial tension erupted into violence. And an ambulance called to the scene to treat five people injured in today's violence has been attacked by a mob who shattered its windows.

I mean read Sam’s headline.

Jeffery I think I speak on behalf of our host as well when I say that I think your views are not only unorthodox but disgusting. In the Middle East we have plenty of people with ugly and dangerous flip side perspectives to yours. Sure they look and talk different but other than that you’re exactly the same.

 
At 12/12/2005 01:23:00 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Rapes in Sweden.

http://fjordman.blogspot.com/

Different country, same religion.

 
At 12/12/2005 01:45:00 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

What's so greeeeeeeeat about a mob of racists lynching other humans with such ugliness and hate,& please, the coast guard incident isn't the reason,the kind of hate emanating from this crowd is so inherent it just needed a petty reason for it to manifest. I'm all for self criticism, we need a lot of it, but your twisted logic, of since those attacked are arabs, then they defenitely desreved it and to gloat over this incident the way you did,only means that you're just a sick self hating bastard. And since we're a race beyond redemption and the only good arab is a dead one, etc. I plead with you to go ahead and dump yourself from the top of the Cairo tower, hey, in your world that's absolutely kosher, one less stinking (really stinking) arab.

 
At 12/12/2005 02:23:00 PM, Blogger LouLou said...

Jeff,

"But hey, I may have unorthodox views.

Myself, I would nuke the Ka'aba just for fun."

That's not unorthodox or original at all . Fascism has been around forever. And it's all over the place really in all shapes & sizes & colors. You're just another one. So if you're thinking this makes you unique or especially interesting think again.

 
At 12/12/2005 03:42:00 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

As an Australian I was sickened as disgusted by the riots and violence in Sydney over the last few days. There is no place in Australia for this kind of behaviour and the sooner the police arrest and jail those involved the better.

Some are using these riots as a way of painting all Australians as racists. I strongly oppose these views and I have some examples to back my views.

The following picture is of a Sydney cop who waded into this effluent of supposed humanity to save the young man tucked under his arm at great risk to his own life. Fighting off attackers with capscium spray and his bare fists.
http://news.ninemsn.com.au/img/slideshow/2005/cronulla/cronulla5.jpg

This video shows the cop from the previous picture and another big cop who fought back a large mob with a baton to save two men's lives.
http://ninemsn.video.msn.com/v/en-au/v.htm?g=2212b5b9-fde7-463b-8d43-583ff328f55e&f=copy

Another example I unfortunately can't get hold of is of an evil attack on one man by the mob but while in the heat of the attack an "Aussie" (the victim's own term) cover the man's head and shoulders with his own body to try and protect him; told him to stay still and he would get him out.

Once again there is no excuse for the evil and sickening attacks on either side. Both mobs seem to prefer to attack innocent people rather than their opposite number in the opposing mobs. What I am happy about is that the police have cracked down hard on both sides and are not going to let either side from becoming a law unto themselves.

Sandmonkey, please don't paint all of us Australians with the same brush. This is not the Australia I know and love.

 
At 12/12/2005 03:53:00 PM, Blogger programmer craig said...

The police are seen as part of the problem. Just like in our Los Angeles riots (which lasted 2 weeks by the way) - which is why I don't think this is going to end soon.

Beachgoers were beaten. Women were not "harassed" - they were threatened with rape, in broad daylight, on a tourist beach. Young girls were verbally assaulted by adulat males while they were attending SWIMMING CLASSES.

I feel sorry for any innocents who get caught up in this mess, but the police clearly let things get so out of hand that nobody has any faith that they'll do anything.

I'm not justifying (or am I?) the riots, but for people to call the rioters bigots, without looking at what the racism and criminal behavior that was happening on that beach is just wrong.

And, no, Karim... I'm not buying the correlation you make between these riots and the anti-Christian riots in EGypt. Sorry. There were no reports of Christians sexually harrassing/intimidating/ beating muslims in Alexandria. Were there?

I know this comment is going to offend a lot of people who I consider to be freinds, but I have to be honest here. The riots in austrailia are not unprovoked. I blame the police, for not criminally prosecuted those Lebanese gang members for what they've been doing the last few months. Cultural tolerance, gone wrong.

 
At 12/12/2005 04:03:00 PM, Blogger Papa Ray said...

I really don't know who's not wrong in all this. To me everybody involved (except the police) shares blame and guilt.

But if you look at the situation in the world, it is not difficult to have seen this coming. The world is starting to seperate into two camps (not counting the whimps that won't fight for anything) and it is going to get much much worse. It may not get better for a century or more.

Call it the awaking of the New Crusades or the Clash of Civilizations, pick a descriptive name but you will have to pick a side also.

Peace loving people are always the ones caught in the middle, and usually suffer greatly in any "war".

Everyone thinks that Iraq is "the war", its but the second chapter and the remaining chapters will be even more bloody and awful.

Call me a doom sayer, call me anything you care too. But remember what I said and be prepared.

Papa Ray
West Texas
USA

 
At 12/12/2005 05:41:00 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

A fellow Aussie here, and I'm watching the news, mouth open, wondering at the sudden change in character.

The racial abuse and violence directed at innocent passers by was utterly wrong, and it sickened me. Being a country of migrants, getting along is a necessity.

However, I do feel if the police had taken action against the growing gang culture in Sydney, which some detectives warned against in Jan 2004 (The Rise of Middle Eastern Crime in Australia), there would have been no 'trigger', no bashed lifeguards, and Australia's reputation wouldn't have taken this battering.

Volunteer services such as the Lifeguards at the beach have such a reputation in the community, and are seen as such a vital, positive part of Australian life, so that the bashings the previous weekend provoked an unprecedentated outrage.

 
At 12/12/2005 07:42:00 PM, Blogger LouLou said...

Craig,

"There were no reports of Christians sexually harrassing/intimidating/ beating muslims in Alexandria. Were there?"

And if there WERE reports of some Christians sexually harrassing/intimidating/beating or even killing some Muslims would that justify indiscriminately attacking anyone who looks Christian?

"I'm not justifying (or am I?) the riots, but for people to call the rioters bigots, without looking at what the racism and criminal behavior that was happening on that beach is just wrong."

Am sorry but those rioters were bigots. If some guy attacks you & you assault him that's not bigotry. It's self-defence. But if some guy steps on your toes & you go after some other guy because he looks like him that's bigotry. It doesn't have any other name. And you can't seriously expect anyone to take you seriously if you claim your victim provoked you by looking or being of the same racial/religious background as your attacker.

Last week my friend & I were sexually harrassed by some Russians. We don't notice ourselves going around insulting & abusing everyone we meet who looks Russian(and there's quite a few of them around) & then expecting people to sympathize with us because a bunch of Russians once harrassed us. Sorry but that logic is just laughable. I expected better of you.

 
At 12/12/2005 07:51:00 PM, Blogger programmer craig said...

LouLou, you know damn good and well that if white Christians immigrants were in Egypt doing (to Egyptian muslims) what these Lebanese gangs have been doing in Austrailia, far worse than this would happen to them. I don't take your revers roleplay very seriously. I don't think you are being honest with yourself on this.

I'm sorry I offended you with my comment. You were one of several people I knew would come down on me for it. I'm in the middle of something right now, but I'll come back and try to explain my position better before I go to bed.

 
At 12/12/2005 08:55:00 PM, Blogger LouLou said...

Craig,

"I'm in the middle of something right now, but I'll come back and try to explain my position better before I go to bed."

Great. That would help. Thanks.:)

"LouLou, you know damn good and well that if white Christians immigrants were in Egypt doing (to Egyptian muslims) what these Lebanese gangs have been doing in Austrailia, far worse than this would happen to them."

Yes am sure there are stupid, bigoted mobs everywhere. That's not the question. The question is do I have to applaud them or make excuses for them or sympathize with them?Egyptian or Australian or even Martian a rioting mob of bigots attacking an innocent person fills me with contempt not understanding.

"I don't think you are being honest with yourself on this."

I am being very honest. Am trying to put myself in the mob's place to see if this will make more sense to me from that perspective. It's not working.

 
At 12/12/2005 10:01:00 PM, Blogger programmer craig said...

Hi LouLou, I'm going to try not to make another run-on post like I usually do when I have a lot to say. We'll see how it works this time :)

I guess I'll address your comments and then put my my opinions at the end.

"Yes am sure there are stupid, bigoted mobs everywhere."

Well, that's the nature of mob mentality, LouLou. But the individuals who make up a mob are not inherently different than anybody else in the community. The only thing that makes them different is that they've crossed the line from being merely angry to being violently enraged. I'm sure it was no different in the French riots. BTW, I made no comment on the rioting in France one way or the other, even though I saw, on many blogs, people claiming that the riots were justified by decades of racism and oppression. I see now, some of those same people who thought the riots in France were justified, claiming the riots in Austrailia are NOT. *shrug*

"The question is do I have to applaud them or make excuses for them or sympathize with them?"

Nope. I don't, why should you? I think the rioters are dead wrong. I alos think the police who ignored a problems situation for months (years?) are at fault. And of course, so are those young muslim males who behaving in an intolerable manner.

One of the first things I learned in the Marines when I went overseas is "Don't mess with their women. They'll kill you for that." And it's true. They will. Doesn't even matter what country. Guys are hardwired that way.

OK, now I'll try an explain where my personal opinions come from. I lived here in Los Angeles 1991(?) during the LA riots. I was about a year out of the Marines then. BTW, that movie "Jarhead" sucks - he and I (the guy who wrote that story) were in different Regiments of the 1st marine Division at the same time, and he's talking about a different Marine Corps than the one I recall. But, anyway, where was I?...

The LA riots. Well, Los Angeles is really spread out, but their aren't any boundaries between towns and neighborhoods. Cross the street and you're in a different city. Hard to explain. The important thing is, I lived in a neighborhood that was about 90% white. Bet to teh east was aneighbohood that was 100% black - and it's a REALLY bad area, a notoriously bad area. To the west was a neighborhood that's about 80% mexican.

For those who don't remember (or never knew) the LA riots began right after the Rodeny King verdict was announced. Blacks were attacking whites on sight, oven while they were being filmed by news helicopters. Stores and businesses owned by anybody who wasn't black were being robbed and burned. Asians were also widely targetted.

So, I was wrorried. My house was a 10 minute walk (if that) from one of the worst black neighborhoods in southern california. I loaded up my assault rifle, loaded every spare magazine I had too, and I was prepared to kill any black person who came onto my property. That's the only time in my LIFE I've been willing to attack somebody, no questions asked, just because of their skin color. Who is the bigot, in this situation? Me, for assuming that any black person who comes onto my property during a blcack on white race riot is there to do me harm? Or the blacks, who really DO mean to do me harm, because I'm white?

Me AND them? I really don't know, LouLou. And I wasn't really thinking about it then. Being politically correct wasn't on my mind, and neither was being culturally sensitive. Luckily, the rioting never left the black neighborhoods.

I guess the point I'm trying to make is all this "who is the racist" talk is irrelevant once riots break out. It's too late. The riots will end when they burn themselves out.

No riot I've ever heard of is *justified* - but all of them are provoked. People don't just get that way, spontaneously. Something pushed them over the edge of reason. These riots in Autrailia will end (if they haven't already) but if nothing is done about the underlying causes, they won't be last riots there. Same with France. I'm hoping we don't have riots again in LA. Race realtions DO seem better here now than they were then, but there's no guarantee.

I don't want you to think I'm endorsing riots, LouLou. The one riot I was in the midst of was very traumatic for me, not least because it forced upon me some self-examination that I would have rather not done. But no riot is unprovoked. It seems to me, after raeding newspaper stories from Austrailia going back a year or two, that the causes of this riot are pretty clear. I hope the aussies can do something about them.

I don't sympathize with the rioters. I sympathize with people who end up beinbg victims jsut for being "x" in a "no x's allowed zone." If I'd had the bad luck to be in south central LA when thsoe riots broke out, the rioters would have killed me, no questions asked. No way, do I ever side with rioters.

 
At 12/13/2005 09:59:00 AM, Blogger LouLou said...

Craig,

"Who is the bigot, in this situation?Me, for assuming that any black person who comes onto my property during a blcack on white race riot is there to do me harm?"

No. You have a right to defend yourself & your property. If someone trespasses on your property or into your home you're under no obligation to give them the benefit of the doubt. It would be good if you could of course but not everyone can. Especially not in the middle of a situation like the one you described with the riots. You clearly had good reason to believe yourself in danger.

But can you imagine yourself wanting to get together with a bunch of white friends & go out looking for some defenceless black person to kill or beat up just to let off steam?That would have been a different proposition altogether no?

"Being politically correct wasn't on my mind, and neither was being culturally sensitive. "

Cultural sensitivity is stuff like removing piggy banks because they might be offensive to Muslims. It's absurd.

What we're talking about here is not cultural sensitivity or political correctness. It's basic human compassion. You didn't like feeling threatened or terrorized because of something a bunch of white cops did over which you had no control no?And so you should identify with another human being caught in the same situation.

"I don't sympathize with the rioters. I sympathize with people who end up beinbg victims jsut for being "x" in a "no x's allowed zone."

Exactly.

"I don't want you to think I'm endorsing riots, LouLou. "

Like I said I was surprised. Thanks for explaining.

"If I'd had the bad luck to be in south central LA when thsoe riots broke out, the rioters would have killed me, no questions asked. No way, do I ever side with rioters."

Well thank God you weren't in south central LA then.:)You're a lucky man.

 
At 12/13/2005 10:20:00 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Sandmokey,

Please don't use irony anymore. It's lost completely on your Egyptian brothers, Karim and Mohamed.

Okay? Greeeeeeeeeeeeaaaattttt!

 
At 12/29/2005 08:31:00 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Mohammed was a schizophrenic. I have had this discussion with more than one Psychology Professor who have read the Koran. They all agree that Mohammeds rantings are those of someone who is bipolar.

 
At 2/21/2006 08:39:00 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

jeffrey you wanna nuke the ka'ba for fun hehehe ur a funny little kid.i would love to see a yankee do something like that but you's are all gutless and know what happens if u fuck with arabs. YOU PLAY WITH FIRE YOU GET BURNT.

 
At 9/29/2006 05:59:00 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

hehha ha ha the beach riots were the best thing that happened honestly, member this chant 'fuck off lebs' thats wat should be happening, australia doesnt want lebo scum wandering our streets being pussys and attacking 1 person with a gang of 20 and most of them are ashamed 2 call themselves aussie, well if u havent noticed ur in australia so if u dont like it go back to ur fucked up third world country and get bombed with everyone else, see problem solved, have a nice day

 

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