Blowback
Action: The nigerian muslims attack their christian counterparts in a fit of MCS rage, killing many and burning churches. Reaction: The nigerian christians riot back, attack their muslim counterparts, killing many and burning mosques. First this and now that. What a fantastic day for inter-religious relations. Oh well... May the cycle of violence begin!
posted by The Sandmonkey @ 2/21/2006 09:27:00 AM
26 Comments:
Why don't we put a ban on religion?
At least the Christians don't take it lying down.
erik - banning religion is not the solution, banning evil would be, but no one admits to being that. We just have to judge people by their actions; unfortunately, going after the wrong doers is a little difficult in Nigeria where the country is divided north and south, Muslims and Christians, respectively.
Joanne
I suspect that is the Main reason we don't hear of such violence (for the most part) in countries like the US and Britain- because the muslim population isn't a high enough percentage, for those who believe in violence to easily get away with it. But when you have equal amounts (or an overwhelming majority)...
That's bad...
Christian's fighting back is not normal, at least in the biblical sense.
Christian's fighting back is not normal, at least in the biblical sense.
Yep, but it sure is normal for muslims to go about hacking people to death.
jonas
This is getting very serious. There must be something else behind this. It cannot be about the cartoons anymore.
It is as if the cartoons were just the spark that ignited a fire that was brewing already.
It is actually very sad. I wish there was a way to stop all this. I think it is too late for apologies by now.
Another sad thing. Insurance compagnies have already raised their prices for compagnies investing in the ME. Fewer compagnies are going to invest in ME now. Any progress is going to slow down, unemployment is going to grow, more people are going to turn to the extremists. In the Europe people are going to turn to the right wing parties, and another conflict is in the horizon.
It seems that history is repeating itself. This sort of antagonism resembles a Crusade-Jihad head to head since Richard Lionheart and Salaah-El Din.
Today, the clash of faiths is not about territory but about the hearts and minds of people. Humans are naturally inclined to search for answers and find true meaning in life - religion is a solution to many. However it does not stop there, they wish to believe (or confirm their belief) that the religion they are following and shaping their life is the gateway to eternity.
Orthodoxically religious Muslims, Christians, Jews, Hindus et al., will do all in their power to GUARANTEE in their minds their admission to eternal life.
The Jews have abided by the Torah and established the state of Israel. The Christians conquered Europe and fought in the name of Jesus Christ. The Muslims are fighting in the name of Jihad.
@anonymous. I agree with you, it is certainly about majority-minority. The Coptic Christians in Egypt experience sporadic acts of violence because they represent only 10% of the Egyptian population. Fanatic Muslims in Egypt feel that they could clash with Coptic Christians and get away with it. Also the fact that Coptic Christians (which are only found in Egypt) have not endured mass genocide (like the Jews in Europe) will not give them a global spotlight.
It is irresponsible to deny the holocaust because of the sensitivity of the subject and perform anti-Semitic acts. However, Christian minorities in Muslim countries are not protected by a grandeur over-arching power.
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I'm optimistic about the future. Yes, some people are burning things, but they are always some people burning things. The clash of civilizations isn't going to happen (on the internet yes, real world no).
All Europe needs to do is make a few people pay the price and the rest will shut up. They burn a few buildings, so what? They are not as strong as you and if you remind them they will back down. Quit worring about tolerance and multi-culturalism and do something really mean. If you do it now you won't have to deal with the CoC later.
-Mike
Not sad, eye opening (hopefuly), maybe a turning point, the world is starting to say enough is enough, we will not tolerate muslim violence and their evil creed any longer.
The world is waking up, slowly but it is happening....either ,muslims join the rest of humanity and start respecting all humans, male and female, from all walks of life , from varied religious beliefs, (or no religious beliefs) , or else get what they seem to want the most, an all out , to the death, war of civilizations, posibly the end of earth as we know it.
Jeff said...
Well...Although I abhore the violence it's good to see that not all Christians in Muslim countries have been dhimmified...
I don't believe that those christians who refuse to resort to violence are dhimmified, but that rather their religious beliefs discourage them from doing so. Turn the other cheek, so the teaching goes. Then, there are those who have to suppress such teachings because they have to protect their love ones from harm.
jonas
Ah no! Earlier today I already wrote about the revengefull words by the Christians in Nigeria. And now it has escalated :(
These fights has been going on for some time.
I find it odd that followers of a religion, who should "turn the other cheek" and followers of "the religion of peace" can get into a fight.
Maybe this is not about religion at all. Maybe this is about power.
@Anon,
But some religious leaders, both Muslim and Christian, said the underlying cause was uncertainty over the political future -- specifically, a rumoured ambition by President Olusegun Obasanjo to stand for a third term in 2007.
In Nigeria - there is the added confusion of tribal loyalty added into the Christian/muslim mix (obviously). It isn't as cut and dried as a Muslim v Christian clash of civilization, and I think it is dangerous to turn it into such.
I don't hate the muslims I just want them out of Europe. Now.
Ok, I lied. I HATE muslims.
"That's bad...
Christian's fighting back is not normal, at least in the biblical sense." by Philipp
Gee, is the only verse in the Bible that is remembered is the "turn the other cheek" one. Please read the Bible, even a little, and you will see that Christians' enemies were handed over to them in defeat, especially when the Christians were keeping God's laws.
Christians have every right to wage war against those who wage war against them. Why is it 400 Christians each day are being killed by Muslims in the Middle East? ...because they can. Do we actually think Muslims would be able to kill 400 Christians each day in Europe and the western hemisphere - very doubtful, their arses would be getting kicked, ...because we can.
The thing is Muslims aren't being targeted and killed in Europe and the western world because the majority of non-Muslim people believe they have the right to choose their own beliefs and Muslims believe if non-Muslims can't or won't choose Islam, they have the right to kill them.
A disclaimer for all Muslims who believe and uphold the belief not to commit murder of any living soul.
Joanne
This was the worse thing Christians in Nigeria could do.
Just going out and killing random Muslims is an act of evil. Finally when people were starting to wake up to how infidels are treated in the Islamic world, they have to go out and wreck it.
The same thing happened in France this weekend. A group of jews were protesting against an Arab group for torturing a kidnapped Jew to death.
Unfortinately, during the protest, some hot-heads started beating up on random lookers. (no one was seriously hurt, thank g-d) But thanx to the riot, we (jews) lose our moral footing.
Each group must do a better job policing their own.
Sandmonkey ya ibni you know very well that the Nigerian tribes have been fighting each other for the last 15 years or so ! pls pls be objective in your reporting ..don't turn it simply into a Christian vs Muslims fight you have always been fair keep being so - at least in Nigeria this is not the sole or main issue.
egyptian observer
I really didnt understand many bits of your post
[It seems that history is repeating itself. This sort of antagonism resembles a Crusade-Jihad head to head since Richard Lionheart and Salaah-El Din. ]
What do you mean by since??
History does not repeat itself, it is merely humans making the same mistake again.
[Today, the clash of faiths is not about territory but about the hearts and minds of people.]
It was always about Hearts & Minds, what territories are you talking about? the crusades again or what?
Ofcourse whomever belives in a faith regards it as the gateway to Heaven, but the problem is when those who believe regard their own faith as Asbolute while others are ignorant for choosing another faith.
This part doesnt make sense at all [The Jews have abided by the Torah and established the state of Israel. The Christians conquered Europe and fought in the name of Jesus Christ. The Muslims are fighting in the name of Jihad]
Do you know that the founding fathers of Israel were zionists who werent religious to abide by the Torah, so this part is not correct.
Now when did Christians conquer Europe? & what are the Muslims fighting exactly & what about those who are not fighting?
& lastly, [ It is irresponsible to deny the holocaust because of the sensitivity of the subject and perform anti-Semitic acts.] which i disagree with. Its not irresponsible to deny the holocaust because of sensitivity, but because its a fact, its like denying ww2 ever took place.
I really didnt understand what you said but it sounded a bit diplomatic.
Hi Sandmonkey,
Violence between Christians and Muslims in Nigeria has been simmering on and off for over two hundred years. It is not purely a religious conflict, there are tribal and political dimensions to it as well. The cartoons may have been an excuse to flare up violence in Nigeria, but in that place, you don't need much of an excuse. It's almost like the Northern Ireland of Africa, except instead of Protestants and Catholics killing each other, we have Muslims and Christians.
May the cycle of violence begin!
Think they might want to trade this in for a Harley?
Nigeria has many problems and one really good thing-OIL. Enough oil to make everyone there have a good prosperous life.
But then you have Thugs in power that take all the money that is made from oil and put it in their pockets.
Poor people make good warriors, they are used to fighting for survival.
Religion gives people strenght and a common bond. But corruption knows no boundries of religion, tribe or race.
Until the rule of fair and equal law is established in a country, county, parish, city, village nothing is possible.
But also it seems, that the western world has more problems with one "religion" (which is much more than "just a religion" but is a cult that controls every aspect of the true believers life) and that religion is Islam.
The Qur'an states that there is but one true religion and that it is Islam and that only the followers of Islam are blessed and will spend eternity with Allah.
All others are nothing, useful only as subservient races to be used and taxed as the Qur'an dictates. It also dictates that if the unbelievers rebel or are not subservient that they must be killed. It dictates that Islam must prevail over all peoples in all lands.
Its very difficult to co-exist with Islam and the true believers of the Qur'an.
Very difficult, in fact so difficult that it may not be possible to co-exist with them.
Islam can not be revised, nor spoke against. To do so brings down a death sentence from the Qur'an.
So, who is the one to change that? Is it to be a second coming? The end of the civilized world?
Or the Muslims that want to survive and live long and happy lives?
Who?
Papa Ray
West Texas
USA
You are not better than all the news paper who distributing insulting cartoon about our beloved Prophet Muhamed peace be upon him, I don't know whether you are Muslim or not you are blaming other when your self post this article, go get a real job and if you are Muslim repent to Allah.
Anon preacher
What is the difference between Allah & God?
How do you know he should repent & get a real job? maybe its you who needs to get a life & to know more about Allah before telling others to repent.
papa ray
Its obvious youre an incorrigible bigot, you want to boast about your poor knowledge of the Quran but in the end show how ignorant you are. The Quran talks about many faith followers as muslims too, it mentions christians , jews & sabeans. A Muslim in the Quran you bighead isnt what the term means today, but what it meant back then, simply as someone who belives in God, a prophet (anyone), in the judgment day & who submits to his power.
Any verses that talked about dominance was spelled out to the early muslims who were in a do or die situation with the powerful Meccans, it didnt generalise.
so please go & revise those books you are reading before you make me puke more over your absurd assertions as if you are some sort of authority on the Quran.
say whatever you want to say about muslims, they themselves dont know what is in the quran & its easy to observe their behaviour, but not what they say about Islam is correct.
"Nigeria has many problems and one really good thing-OIL. "___Oil is not a good thing. It is the worst curse a country can have. Gold mines are almost as bad - the lavish supplies of gold from America ruined Spain, just as oil is ruining the Arab countries.
@Jokerman. Thanks for your comments.
Let me clarify.
When I mentioned the Crusade-Jihad head to head battle, I brought up the example of Lionheart and Salaah-El Din because it represents a prime example of Christian-Muslim antagonism. What I mean by 'since' is since that time.
History repeating itself is meant to be an analogy. The reason why I stated that the clash of faiths is not about terrority ANYMORE but about the heart and minds of people (only possible exception is Israel-Palestine which again has started to steer away from a battle of religions) is because like you said, terrority has been conquered already. (examples of sectarian violence are rampant all over the world: Egypt, Nigeria, Iraq, Eastern Europe etc.)
The founding fathers of Israel were Zionists who abided by the Torah ENOUGH to make Israel a national homeland for Jews - that is what matters in this case.
I do believe that the Holocaust took place. The reason why I said it is irresponsible to deny it is because there are figure-heads which have the audacity to deny it. To them the Holocaust is not fact - this is more of a figurative statement - but to me it is.
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